Tuesday, November 25, 2008

Fallen Idols

I've heard many an erudite discussion about whether one can possibly listen to Wagner because he was a Nazi anti Semitic wanker. No one seems to mention that the real problem is sitting for hours with a numb bum just waiting for the good bits.

But I do struggle with the problem of enjoying my heroes when they do something I don't like.

I adored Eric Clapton until the 'Enoch was right' speech after which Layla didn't sound quite so sublime.

Brian Ferry (born into a working class Geordie family) became a fox hunting class traitor. Now 'Avalon' and 'Love is the Drug' will never speak to me in the same way.
I'm not the only one.

Here's his son Otis who was named after a lift

Why did John Travolta (such an excellent screen actor) have to join the Scientologists?
Carol Vorderman (above) made it OK for girls to be swotty and get their sums right.

Then she went and wore that tarty dress, detoxed herself to a nonentity and advertised anti cholesterol debt consolidation companies on daytime TV.

My all time cricketing hero was Clive Lloyd (Lancashire and West Indies). Watching Clive bat at Old Trafford on a sunny afternoon with a pint of real ale in your hand was heaven on earth.

So imagine how I felt when he turned out to be a Thatcher supporting Tory.

And possibly worst of all - Teddy Sheringham the dimpled football hero had to go and shack up with the awful Danielle Lloyd.

I can't imagine what he saw in her.

Can you ignore the transgressions of your heroes and still enjoy what they do?




Blogger Dave said...

Well, nearly all of us have feet of clay.

Literally, in my case, after I've been digging in my garden.

9:15 am  
Anonymous NiC said...

Up to a point yes.

I think "Love the art but not the artist" or something more snappy was sort of the way I looked at it.

Incidentally after Teddy Teddy Sheringham went to Man U, opposing fans used to sing:
"Wo, Teddy, Teddy, he went to Man United and won f*$k all". Curiously when he helped the Reds to the treble they didn't modify the chant.

I'm afraid I don't know who Danielle Lloyd is but she does seem to be suffering from the same android skin complaint as the evil Vorderman.

9:33 am  
Blogger Murph said...

"When Benecol said they would pay me £800k, I said 'prove it!'".

Len Fairclough let me down.

10:14 am  
Blogger Betty said...

All of my heroes let me down eventually, so I've had to learn to ignore the stupid things they do. Talented people seem to have a tendency to behave badly. Is it due to the money, the attention, the drugs? Probably due to all three.

Bryan Ferry is now apparently dating one of his son's old girlfriends. There's no fool like an old fool.

10:15 am  
Blogger scarlet-blue said...

I kind of agree with Nic, but it is a little soul destroying. Best not to hero worship too much, and take what they say and do with a large teaspoon of salt.

10:21 am  
Blogger Vicus Scurra said...

Thank God that I can rely on you, Kaz.

11:06 am  
Blogger KAZ said...

No Excuse!

I remember you commented here once that you didn't like it when Bowie went to Switzerland as a tax exile.
I can still listen to him with pleasure - but my Brian Ferry CDs stay in the drawer.
Danielle was the scouser who was involved in the Big Brother race scandal with Jane Goody.

You are a wise old dawg.
Rita's never been the same since.

Yes - Brian's the one I can't deal with and that's not fair to the other members of Roxy Music who are no doubt blameless.

Good advice - though isn't salt bad for you.
Are there no innocent pleasures any more?

You cartainly can.
Solid as a Northern Rock - that's me.

11:32 am  
Blogger MJ said...

Did Albert Tatlock have any transgressions?

12:03 pm  
Blogger I, Like The View said...

in reality they are all just ordinary people*, like the rest of us

faults and all

only we get to read about theirs in the tabloids and celebrity mags - that must be as much of a burden for them as it is for us to see them reduced to normailty

(*not that I'm suggesting you or your readers are ordinary, KAZ)

my celebrity hero has to be Patrick Moore - I've never read a bad word about him

12:10 pm  
Blogger BEAST said...

Thats right rip the scabs off those barely healed wounds .

The Gary Glitter Xmas Gangshow used to be a highlight of the year.

Then Willow became a great big Lezza in Buffy

1:17 pm  
Blogger Geoff said...

Bobby Moore was my only hero. I just want to remember him as he was holding the World Cup.

When Queen played Sun City it made not an iota of difference to me.

But when Vince Hill did that song about Thatcher I was mortified.

1:29 pm  
Blogger Ackworth born said...

I didn't know who Danielle Lloyd was until I read the comment above - but then I didn't really care who she was anyway.

I've mostly enjoyed CV on countdown but mostly in spite of her obnoxious traits (detox and debt promotion) and though she was always a bit too big for her boobs (oops I mean boots) she got worse after Richard died and tried to take over the show - not that some of the choices for chairman were very good - anyhow she's had her come-uppance now (probably) - be interesting to see how the new folk fare as I don't really know who they are.

2:46 pm  
Blogger The Poet Laura-eate said...

I've never forgiven Brian Ferry either for sneering at his own working class roots and pretending he was something he isn't - though perhaps he really is a pretentious pompous pr*ck and it wasn't a lie! Though in a way that's how you know someone isn't genuinely posh - 'cos the real thing tend to be dead nice wearing 30-year old cords, driving old cars and not at all what the pretenders always think they are!

But what about Joan Armatrading, the frickin' Tory, eh? I'll never sing along to one of her tracks again!

3:18 pm  
Blogger Steve said...

The Stranglers were right: no more heroes anymore. I prefer waiting for the moment the people I hate on TV suddenly do something impressive and admiration-worthy.

Yeah yeah. I'm still waiting.

6:59 pm  
Blogger Gordie said...

I still think Gill Sans is an excellent typeface, even though its creator buggered his sister, his daughter, and his dog.

Eric Clapton: dedicated himself to Christianity, heroin and Enoch Powell (in that order). He stole George Harrison's wife, married her, was repeatedly unfaithful to her, and fathered children by two other women. Then, in the ultimate and deepest betrayal, he played on a Roger Waters solo album. I've never been able to forgive him.

I think Bryan Ferry was genuinely pretentious from an early age: he wasn't just putting on an act. It's true his family were working class, but his Dad looked after pit ponies, which is a puff's job in the North East.

Scientology has always been very good at exploiting wealthy closet gays, once they've been persuaded to confess their impulses to the Church's 'auditors'. (I wonder why I thought of that today? It's probably not relevant.)

8:05 pm  
Blogger KAZ said...

Yes - he used to shag young Tracy Barlow behind the antimacassar.

Ah - Kev loves Patrick Moore ever since he saw him play the xylophone at the opening of the Penguin Pool at Chester Zoo.

Those are two of the saddest cases of disillusionment I can think of.
You need a new hero to follow - can I suggest Joan Bakewell, Mark Owen or Paula Radcliffe.

Ah but no doubt the main factor in your recovery from Vince's transgressions was thinking about the selfless charity work of Bono and Sting.

8:58 pm  
Blogger KAZ said...

The 'new' Carol is an attractive 22 year old blonde with an Oxford degree.
Bet Carol is sick as a parrot.

What - Joan Armatrading a Tory.
Oh no no no - and I identified closely with the words she wrote as well as enjoying the music.
I really should toughen up a bit.

You mean like Noel Edmonds donating his entire salary to Save the Whale - or even Michael Parkinson retiring with dignity instead of doing adverts on daytime TV (not that I watch it of course).

I knew about the perversions of Eric Gill - but I only just made the connection with Gill Sans.
I'll be sticking to Ariel from now on.

re Brian Ferry - good point - he was probably irresistably drawn to the upper class lifestyle of his wife.
But why did he have to act like such a perfect plonker?

8:59 pm  
Blogger Gordie said...

"Too much cheesecake too soon.
Don't let this happen to you."
He wrote the words, but didn't heed the warning.

12:21 am  
Blogger Old Wom Tigley said...

I'm not one for Hero's Kaz...
I set my standards much lower. Pinky and Perky never disgraced me.... Bill and Ben always remained on good terms with little weed, which was nice to know.
I knew where I was with Ena Sharples, who for some unknow reason I wanted as my granny.
My only glitch had to be Gary Glitter... now 'NO one wants to be in his gang' and rightly so.

I've had a right laugh this morning catching up on your last few posts... hope you are well... I'm full of 'Man Flu' ( Slight sniffles) Jane is as fit as a Dray Horse but not as pretty..:O)
Thanks for the message... nice to know I'm not forgotten

11:45 am  
Blogger KAZ said...

'And stay cool is still the main rule'

Muffin the Mule never let me down - but I never trusted that Sooty especially when Sweep came on the scene.

The University students all loved Gary Glitter. He was sort of a cult ... I think that was the word.

Hope the flu gets better soon and you stay well.

1:06 pm  
Blogger garfer said...

Pete Townshend for viewing child porn and George Best for going on the wagon (briefly).

2:13 pm  
Blogger Malc said...

Could have told you about Clapton - West Brom fan.
Derek Dougan was a violent, obnoxious drunk, Noddy Holder doesn't like Christmas and don't get me started about a certain political party I bust my bollocks to get elected in 1997.

6:11 pm  
Blogger Gordie said...

George Best for not sobering up for matches (even briefly), and Pete Townshend for being convinced he invented the Internet.

6:20 pm  
Blogger Common Tater said...

Ah yes indeed..the double edged sword of Celebrity.

How could we ever expect Movie Stars/Actors for example, and a bad one at that, to be role models.
What ever gave us the impression that if we were impossibly beautiful, insanely talented, and ridiculously wealthy, that we could pull it all together?

Aside from the true sociopathic-megalomaniacs, most Celebrities hover about in a world of disbelief that we create for them. I suspect that 90% of the time they are embarrased and completely aware that they don't really deserve the adulation or the trappings.

The looks are a random act of genetic sequencing, most film actors enjoy the benefits of generous "editing and special effects", and the value for their services is preposterous...

if aliens came to Earth they would have a hard time understanding why we value Actors and Athletes over teachers and surgeons and parents.

We can enjoy what they do but once they start believing their own spin you had better get out the salt...speaking of which Sir Bob Geldof is coming to town for an award. The Rat's song "I never loved Eva Braun" is still one of my faves.

Here's a guy who was an outsider spitting mad at the status quo and all of it's shimmering baubles. Remember the whole INXS Hutchens suicide love triangle? That was messy...but crap happens.

I appreciate that he is still channeling his anger at the system He HATES the world, but is he spot on about everything? No.
Neither is Bono, his planet saving partner with the antithetical LOVES THE WORLD doctrine.

I do admire them for doing something about it..and in the end who am I to judge? I would prolly self destruct within a year if I had all of the trappings at my beck and call...
love to find out? sort of.

7:47 pm  
Blogger KAZ said...

Oh yes - but that was 'research'. He's not exactly a Gary Glitter is he?
Actually typing that reminded me - I once heard Pete Townshend in an inteview say that his son asked if he could get Gary Glitter's autograph for his school mates.

Poor old George - talented drunk and doomed.

I don't think Derek Dougan was drunk at the Blackburn Rovers supporters club Christmas do in Chorley Town hall.
But he's now a leading light in UKIP.

George could play top class football after a night on the drink that would kill most of us.

Many of us seem to need our celebrities and heroes. Mine are all talented and charismatic - both seem to be necessary.
I also admire Bob and Bono for doing something - except that I feel that it's mainly about them.
Hope you get your chance to 'find out' - why not?
Someone has to do it.

8:02 pm  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

It reminds me of something I said in a post a while back... when I was much younger, I believed so much in some books that I idealized them. Somewhere along the way I realized they had been written by human beings, some of them younger than I was (after I had got old enough)... which spoilt things for me a bit!

I collect teddy bears, and at times remember that many of them were mass produced and then mass retailed... those lovable, individual bears are all about business and profits.

I try not to pay too much attention to that, and enjoy things (books, songs, pictures, bears, whatever) for what they are and what they mean to me personally. I love 'Wonderful Tonight', 'More Than This,' 'Dance Away' and so on... beautiful songs, tied into my past.

"Underneath, you'll find I'm just the same. Running wild... like you do when all your dreams fall through. I can always pretend that I'll fall in love again."

('Running Wild' by Roxy Music)

1:14 am  
Blogger nwtrunner said...

As an old time Roxy Music listener - I've always wanted it to be more about the band than Bryan Ferry, but that was hard to do with an ego as big as his. Hadn't heard about him with his son's ex-girlfriend - gonna have to do a Google on this...

I remember when I was much much younger and I found out that my hero Guy Lafleur - the Captain and heart of Les Habitants de Montreal, Les Glorieux, the Montreal Canadiens - used to smoke in between periods during hockey games. Devastated me. But to this day - can only wonder how much better he'd have been if he'd not been smoking! He was beauty to watch and put up incredible numbers. Won a whole pile of Stanley Cups too.

I'll bet even MJ was a Guy Lafleur admirer, if not an outright fan!

No matter how much a lowlife Bryan Ferry might be - "Prairie Rose", "Virginia Plain", and "Avalon" will always be great tunes! With an asterix maybe....

5:06 am  
Blogger nwtrunner said...

Oh, and I can't imagine what that football guy Terry saw in that gal either. As you asked - what was he thinking??! The man obviously has no taste in women. Or weemin if Old Knudsen is reading this.

5:13 am  
Blogger MJ said...

NWT: They don't make 'em like LaFleur or The Rocket anymore.

6:04 am  
Blogger tom909 said...

Oh my God, I'm out of synch with blogland again here. I'd say Danielle looks pretty nice in that photo. I find her rather sweet - she's just a bit thick, but that doesn't bother me.
I like Abi Titmuss too - I just love the way she's got blokes weighed up. And I like Lily Allen - she's not thick, she's just politically very naive and right wing, but hey, she's very sweet and I love her album.
Frank Zappa was a pretty good 'hero' for me too - and of course you have to love Keith Richard.

9:43 am  
Blogger Gordie said...

I envy tom909 for the ability to fancy girls who are a bit thick; that would broaden my horizons considerably.

Although I have to say Abi Titmuss made the worst porn I've ever seen. If she's a lesbian, I'm Peter Mandelson.

10:32 am  
Blogger KAZ said...

You are quite right.
When Eric and Bryan are long gone (like Wagner) the music will still be there to enjoy.
Probably the person who designed the the teddy wasn't thinking primarily about profit.

Yeah - the other Brian's OK.
Guy Lafleur ?
Not really a household name in UK. But I'm sure he was the Georgie Best of Canada.

Inexplicable - she was only Miss GB - but then he was one of the judges!

mj - or I suppose you should be MJ now.
See above - culture problems.

Danielle has AS level chemistry - so not too thick.
I don't blame her for making the most of her assets.
It's Teddy - what is it with these men?
I too love Keef.

Hi Mandy :
See above - perhaps we've found your perfect match.

10:50 am  
Blogger zIggI said...

I haven't got over Harry Potter getting his willy out on stage.

5:13 pm  
Blogger KAZ said...

I just saw the photos but I saw that play with my mother years ago.
OOh the embarrassment.

9:55 am  
Blogger Pete said...

I can see what he sees in her!

1:50 pm  
Blogger KAZ said...

What - even without your bins?

2:56 pm  
Blogger Flaming Nora said...

I won't hear a bad word about The Tedster. You hear me? Not one.

3:17 pm  
Blogger KAZ said...

Lovely Dimples.

5:10 pm  
Blogger Richard said...

Oh, I could tell you a couple of things about Clive Lloyd. Lovely bloke but he had an eye for the young ladies did Clive, especially, Andrea, an old workmate of mine who was a daughter of one of his friends. Whenever he was in London he used to call her. She never obliged.

I did hear Clapton qualify the Enoch comment so I'll let him off. I may be extremely distantly related to Ferry. We don't talk to them any more.

5:05 pm  
Blogger KAZ said...

OH dear - Clive seemed so god like when I used to watch Lancashire.
In the West Indies team of the time Viv Richards was the 'wide boy' and Clive the 'goody'.
Never mind - I'll get over it.
I put on a Roxy CD this afternoon and managed to enjoy it.

8:46 pm  
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4:56 am  

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